Speaker 1: (00:02)
Bill, Can I help you?
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Speaker 1: Wait, who? Who are you?
I’m your host. Sam Taggart, creator of the D2D experts in D2Dcon. Is there a place we can sit down?
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Speaker 2: (00:48)
Hey Everybody. This is Sam Taggart, your host with the D2D podcast. And I’m here with Kristian Calibuso from New Jersey all the way on live Facebook and on the live. And whenever this stuff, we’re streaming Soundcloud, it, I don’t know what this is on. Yeah, so we got, we got Christian in the house. He is a, he doesn’t even do door to door or just in college baseball. Can I get room? Nah, he’s the senior vice president of Trinity Solar, which is the largest solar company in the East Coast. If you sold solar on the east coast, you kind of like, trinity is in my neighborhood and you’ll know who they are and uh, no. So he has managed, you know, what, upwards of 600 people plus at this point.
Speaker 3: (01:35)
Yeah. We have 600 sales reps in the world, uh, you know, for 1700 employees as a company. So yeah, pretty, pretty big space for us to go play in.
Speaker 2: (01:45)
Yeah. And I think, uh, when you first got him, you, when you first got to trinity, how many guys were there?
Speaker 3: (01:50)
Oh, goodness. I believe I was employed just over a thousand and maybe just, uh, two years before that, let’s say three years before that. And we had maybe a 200 employees so that the growth has been astronomical over the years. So it’s just been fun to watch.
Speaker 2: (02:05)
So I know, I know hundreds of solar companies that are like, oh, we’d love to, uh, have more than five people. You know what I mean? It’s like, so, um, so I think if that’s you and you’re listening to this and you’re like, oh, I’ve got a team of, you know, six or seven centers, it’s like, well Christian’s got a team of like, I dunno, hundreds of say. You know what I mean? Like I think this is B one you probably want to listen to because we’re going to be talking about, you know, how to structure things. The difference in working with leaders that have different backgrounds and merging things together, different center and closer programs and kind of how to manage those. And so, you know, I think if, you know, even in the roofing space, you know, I consult a lot of roofers and it’s a similar sale where you, you know, it’s a slower process, you’ve got to, you know, kind of baby that baby, that customer through install. So this would be a really powerful one for roofing owners, roofing leaders, and then also people just looking to be better leaders, I think, you know, in any industry, like, you know, stepping their game up and working with different dynamics and whatnot. So this is kind of your podcast, if this is you and uh, yeah, let’s dive into it. So tell me, I guess my favorite question is like, who recruited you and how did they recruit you in where you easy, where it hard? Tell me about that.
Speaker 3: (03:25)
That’s a good question. So when I was at protection one, um, one of my guys and Brandon fruitier rod was, was actually one of my reps wanting to get into solar for the really the past two seasons that we were there. I talked to him out of it. Each time he ended up coming over to trinity and, um, you know, as I was getting out of protection one solely because Adt, uh, you know, acquired p one, I forced me to look elsewhere. Uh, so with that, um, I started when I went to the event check out viven ink, went out to legacy, checked out legacy. Um, and then I’m like, I, Brandon had a, the VP at the time, Josh Williams, uh, reach out to me just for a recruiting trip. So decided to come out for a steak dinner, uh, fell in love with the company, you know, came on. Um, yeah, so the guy who recruited me was a Joshua Williams at the time who now runs and yeah, amazing dude,
Speaker 2: (04:14)
we need to get him on his podcast. Um, okay. So then, so you said, okay, I guess, so when you first started endorsing sales, what was it easy? Was it hard? Like did you just pick it up right away? Did you like suck at the beginning? Tell me your first day. What did that look like?
Speaker 3: (04:34)
Really good question. So I drive to Indiana, right? And this is after I quit my job. I drive out there, I’m super stoked, had a couple buddies who are out there. Um, and I wasn’t really connecting the dots on what door to door really was. So I go out there, I watch himself literally his first store, I think it was Ryan Gibbs cause out there, crushes it. And I say, Hey, I think I got this I of thing I got it on my own. If I get a cell, can I just call you? Uh, cause look, I think I’d have to talk to people, right? So I ended up going, I go, I, he drops me off in this hood. Literally after the first sale. Scm Do, I can’t be there for longer than 40 minutes in area. I just got to Indiana. Um, drops me off in this hood.
Speaker 3: (05:12)
I knocked my first door. I don’t get it. I get my pitch off. It was pretty easy to do. Um, my second door, I get the sale, I get inside, get inside. Um, I sell the SLD alarm and I didn’t know what it take over was. So my entire first year of alarms I just did. Freshies. Um, so I get it, I get to the back door. I started talking about the, you know, the, the potential threats that could come back to the back door as, as well as I was taught to do. Literally on the first sale that I saw. Uh, get my manager or call, I say, hey dude, I had this one locked up. Can you please come help me do the paperwork. Um, ends up driving over a, helps me, gets the sale. I go to my next door, I also get that door.
Speaker 3: (05:51)
Um, so literally on my first day, I knocked out my first out of my three doors, I picked up two sales. Uh, and probably my first year through alarms, I thought I was just lucky. You know, I, I truly felt that every single person I got to, I was like, goodness, how the heck did I connect to that customer? So well, you know, but I’ve come to them, the philosophy of luck for me. Um, I read this quote many places, uh, luck is when preparation meets opportunity. So I found that, you know, was, was door to door and was selling the alarm hard. Um, if you look at it like selling the alarm, yes, it was hard. Um, but I looked at it as I was just having really good conversations and making a friend with people on the doors. Uh, so I kind of, uh, uh, sales and really what I was doing, if that makes sense.
Speaker 2: (06:36)
Had you, had you done any sales before that?
Speaker 3: (06:39)
Um, super funny question. Uh, in, in high school, I actually sold door to door newspaper. My freshman. Yeah. Dude, I sold, I sold, dropped me off. Yeah, I did. I had a little, a little slang, Carrie and newspapers knocking door to door. I had to be 14 years old or 15 years old, something like that. I’m selling full packages for fricking newspaper. So yeah. I’ve, I’ve done a couple of sales jobs before.
Speaker 2: (07:05)
That’s awesome. Yeah, me. Yeah. Can you see me? Was it
Speaker 3: (07:15)
a tad? A Tad? Okay, that’s cool. Okay, so question. Yup. When you first started,
Speaker 2: (07:27)
what advice would you give to these brand new guys? Obviously it sounds like you kind of went in cocky or like, I got this, I can do this. Um, what, what advice would you give those kinds of new guys?
Speaker 3: (07:40)
Sure. It’s funny because I would actually go with the exact opposite approach of what I went with, you know, I found that, I find that, you know, I like to go after a cowboys and athletes, right. Athletes just don’t know how to lose. And cowboys are just hard workers, which would be construction workers. I find that athletes who are used to winning every time, um, let’s say like a football player who you’re not used to making mistakes. It’s a lot more challenging to do this job because you’re used to the consistent winning. Whereas I played baseball dude to it to perform throughout a 10 times. That’s a win for me. So to say, I was used to losing. I think that’s the best way I can put it. So really going into going into doors right at first is to have realistic expectations. You’re not going to go out there, you’re not going to get your first door.
Speaker 3: (08:23)
You’re probably not going to get your second door. In fact, you’re probably not going to get your first hundred doors. Uh, play the lottery, right? Learn from the top leaders that are out there and understand that there’s a learning curve and there’s really no definitive learning curve, whether it’s one day, one week or three months. Um, go out there and put the hard work in Lauren from the leaders who are around you and don’t set these high lofty goals. That one, you don’t even know what the sector is like, get out there, understand the job, connect with people and look for the small wins versus the big ones. You know, you can have a positive conversation and that’s a win.
Speaker 2: (08:56)
I love that because you know, you kind of said something that was, it stood out to me when you were like, Hey, when I first started I didn’t really, I don’t really get what door to door was. And then you just said, you know, you got to learn from the best and go learn from your leaders and go be humble, be hungry. And it kind of brings me into like, you know, you’re, you’re one of the keynote speakers at door to door con. I know you’re a pretty skeptical about the whole event last year. Uh, you know, a lot of, a lot of people were, but now knowing kind of what it is and it is a neutral playing ground where it’s not to recruit and it’s where people can really come and, and help expose their people to really, what door to door is. I mean like what a better place to like show the world.
Speaker 2: (09:39)
It’s like this is what we are as a tribe, take some pride and take the job serious. And it’s, you can literally change the rest of your life, your destiny, your legacy, you leave because of this job. But I think most people that do it, they’re like, well, I’ll just do this til I can get a real job. I’ll just do this. You know what I mean? Like, oh, it’s just a sales thing, you know, that was come and go. But it’s like you’ve obviously taken this as a career and I saw you just bought or built a house.
Speaker 3: (10:10)
Speaker 2: (10:14)
a fairly nice one in New Jersey. And you know what I mean? It’s like if people know Christians, like he’s living large. I mean, and yes, it’s off of door to door sales money. Like congratulations. You know what I mean? It’s like, and I think a lot of people, they, they fail to really grasp, um, this whole industry. And you know what I mean? It was interesting that you said, I just picked up on this like you’re like, I didn’t really understand like what I was getting into. You know what I mean?
Speaker 3: (10:43)
Yeah. I was having this conversation with our RBP lead generation, Chris Gardner the other day, and he said that, you know, we, we came to the conclusion of, you know, the problem with door to door is that people think it’s just door to door. It’s not, it’s more than door to door. You’re creating a lifestyle that you can have, let’s say a limited income and limited impact and ultimately you can really do door to door with any business that you’re going into. So, uh, you know, and it goes along with what I said, I didn’t really know what I was getting into and I’m, I’m so happy that, you know, you have door to door con, you’re, you’re getting out there in the public what is door to door and it’s not seen as this low level sales entry level position. Forget that you’re, you’re going to meet some of the best, biggest and baddest leaders that you’ve ever met in your entire life. They come from the door to door sector. So I’m very, very excited to get to a door to door Khan as you said last year. I was a tad bit skeptical. Love it solely because you know, I thought it would be a recruiting frenzy and you’ve proven a with your consistency with your podcast. Um, again, with the results of last year, I’m just excited to be around industry leaders, to learn from them, to come back to my company, uh, and help us develop the, to to be bigger and better.
Speaker 2: (11:52)
That’s, that’s awesome
Speaker 3: (11:54)
man. What are you, what do you mean, what are you most excited to share? You know, guys, those are lessening. Kristin is a workshops, you know, host. He’s literally, he got to, he’s got on the stage and he’s going to drop some nuggets. But I guess like, what are you, what are you excited to kind of bring to the table to that? Like where do you, what are you fired up about that? Yeah, man. You know, it’s very similar to what I like or what your initiative as well, right? And bringing integrity and bringing the grow, the true growth back to this market and really showing, really showing the, the, the, the, the, uh, I can’t think of the word, let’s say the, the beauty of door to door. Right? And especially while I’m here while I’m here at Trinity, you know, you asked me to speak on motivating top teams and it’s not easy to motivate a top team month after month after month. Right? It’s easy to go do it in my opinion, for four months of the summer. But how do you go do it 12 months out of a year?
Speaker 2: (12:47)
Yeah, same stuff every day.
Speaker 3: (12:51)
And you get them amped up when it’s Christmas time. When it’s w I live in New Jersey, it’s, there’s snow on the ground, there’s no end in sight when it’s January in summer’s not for five months from now. Right. I walked outside this morning. It’s 40 degrees outside. So how do we continue to mode our, our, our reps and our employees to go continue to perform at top levels because you know, as we know, carrots and sticks don’t necessarily work all the time. So how do we make this be a career, not just a job that we come into a land somewhere else. So really, uh, you know, narrowing down what am I excited to speak about this career that we do have in door to door.
Speaker 2: (13:27)
I love it. I love it. Well, let’s dive into, let’s dive into some of these nuggets. So talk to me. Can I ask you like really personal questions? So you sold, you know, a megawatt and six months, which, you know, in the solar space guys, a golden door award is a megawatt. Well he did it in a half of a year. There were only four people in the entire industry last year that earned a golden door award. You know what I mean? To put things into perspective. So if you’re listening to this, like the guy knows how to sell. Um, but I get a question and I’m not trying to like, and I’m trying to, don’t take offense. I’m sure you’ve had this question. Got You. You know, you’re not King New Jersey. What ethnicity are you?
Speaker 3: (14:10)
Oh, great question. Filipino,
Speaker 2: (14:13)
Puerto Rican. Filipino. Yeah. You know what I mean? Times people are like, well I can’t sell it cause I’m not some pretty white guy.
Speaker 3: (14:20)
Speaker 2: (14:20)
I mean, you’re a pretty to reach, you can guess. Don’t you ever get that? I mean there’s some fit dark, handsome guy, but it’s like, you know what many times people come to me and they’re like, well I just can’t really knock these neighborhoods. Or you know, like people don’t trust me. I mean it’s like you were one of the best out there, so I’m going to make this, I’m going to make this known just so that anybody that’s dealing with this mentality of like I’m the here, they can overcome that because obviously do something.
Speaker 3: (14:55)
Yeah, that’s, that’s what said. I’m so glad you brought that up and to be transparent with you, Sam, a lot of leaders will not ask that question solely because let’s not say it’s the elephant in the room, but it’s just weird to ask. So I actually, uh, thanks for asking that. You know, and I’ll tell you this, do I have the mindset when I go out there that I may not be the same color as a majority of the demographics out there or they’re going to look at me differently? Hell No, absolutely not. I have a voice just like anyone else does. I feel that if I go, I lead with my personality, my smile, what does it matter what I look like, who I am held taller, how short I am, how in shape or how out of shape I am a. So most importantly, I find that, um, you know, leading to this company, uh, I am one of the, uh, let’s say most ethnic people at the top of the company. I find that a way to motivate some of the, some of those that are coming into the company. You know, you’ll find that a lot of guys say, well, it’s hard to go sell in a, are a rich, affluent, white neighborhood bull bull crap that has nothing to do with your ethnicity. Uh, it has 100% to do with your presentation, your personality, and uh, you know, overall the way you present yourself, how you speak, how you articulate your words. Um, so thanks for asking that. Hell No, absolutely not.
Speaker 2: (16:05)
Love it. Love it. I just needed to, like, for me, I just feel like there’s, there’s so many people out there that are like, you know, I’ll never be great. And I’m just like, dude, the guy makes millions of dollars knocking doors. Like come on. Like it’s like you can do like of cooling, right? So yeah. I’m like, anyways, so let’s kind of leadership you’ve dealt, you kind of modge podge this old school. So Trinity has kind of an interesting background. Sure. So, you know, this whole Josh Williams kind of merged with trinity and this whole like we’re disrupting this previous culture and kind of this different dynamics of leadership. Talk to me a little bit about how that kind of went down and then kind of maybe some of the struggles and the, the winds of having some really dynamic backgrounds in this structure of trigger.
Speaker 3: (16:57)
That’s a really good question. Sam. We find that say they enter industry, right? Let’s say you go to an alarm company, typically all the leaders from that company, they came from the alarm sector. Let’s say you go into roofing, they’re typically all from our roofing backyard of some sort or pest control seem exactly where I find that solar is actually a little bit different. So let’s take away the trinity part and I’ll get into that. Get into that in a second. But let’s just talk about solar. Because solar is, uh, let’s say newer, uh, to the, to the door to door sector, whereas you’re going to have guys that come from pests, from alarms, from cable, from roofing, really all over. But what I found here, what I found here at the company that I work with, I worked for a CEO who’s been in the traditional right salesman ship for the past 24 years.
Speaker 3: (17:43)
So he started out as a heating and air company, ended up doing solar and oh four. And the man’s never knocked on a nor has he seen a door team perform. So to come into this company and show him that, hey, this door to door, this door to door, a presence that we can bring can truly revamp your company. Not only um, you know, with integrity but also with explosive growth in the markets that you want. So every conversation that I have a, you know, with my CEO, it’s, it’s uh, let’s say it’s, it’s, it’s almost mind blowing, right? He says, people will move to New Jersey to come knock doors. I say, tell me, let me just show you. So we literally get guys just as you do to move across country to come see this solar opportunity. But what I find is regardless of what leaders come from, what industry, these guys have great knowledge to bring to the table.
Speaker 3: (18:28)
And as long as they can lead with, let’s say lead with an open mind, have a curious mindset, ultimately get the buy in of the individuals. It has no relevance of what industry you came from. Because again, as we said, it’s about the personality that you bring to the table, right? Do you have the right perspective on what it takes to get a sale to the roof or did it get a cell completed? Forget about to the roof. Can you go from, from from point of contact to point of sale. And for me it doesn’t matter what industry you come from. Um, and I think the overlapping, um, let’s say common common thing that you would need is, is leadership. It doesn’t matter, uh, you know how you’re going to get into a door or whatnot. Do you have the leadership that can collaborate all the ideas together to get to put the best idea forward?
Speaker 2: (19:09)
So what’s your, I guess if you had to give like your top three principles of leadership that you found kind of, you know, modge launching all these different backgrounds, different people via to give like three simple nuggets, what would they be like? My top three principles?
Speaker 3: (19:27)
Yeah, that’s a good, that’s a really good question. I’d probably say number one is buyin you have to be able to influence people and by and that gums into many different categories of what I’m speaking on there. But you have to get the buy in from your people, right? Inclusive of the guy that’s sitting next to you and the guy that’s above you. Next. You have to have prudence, you have to met, you have to have the ability to make the right decision. I find that, you know, if you come from a different industry, you may be jaded in which way you’re going to, your decision process can be, if you can’t come and leveled the playing field and say, hey, this is the right decision, regardless of who it came from, um, you’re, you’re in the wrong place. Right. And number probably the last one is perspective, right? You have to be able to put yourself in another person’s shoes to find out why are they bringing this idea to the table and is this truly going to be what’s best for the company?
Speaker 2: (20:13)
Yeah. So how is it hard sometimes to get the right perspective? Because I do feel, do you feel like your perspective is challenged quite a bit as a leader?
Speaker 3: (20:24)
Always. I think we can. We can both agree to that. Or your perspective is always going to be a challenge solely because they were going to say a couple of things. Right? Well Christian, you’re young, well Christian, you come from the alarm industry, you don’t, you just don’t get it. And my job is not to convince you to under two to agree with my idea. My job is to get you to understand my perspective. I’m just asking yourself in my shoes and see it the way people will see it. You know a Samuel, you’ll, you can identify me as a player’s coach. My job is to get out there, identify some of the pain points in the field and ultimately create solutions. They get more deals to the roof. So for me, do I find it difficult? It’s always going to be difficult, right? That’s our job. Our job as leaders is to be able to show that perspective the right way and they get people to, to see, to see what we’re saying, not, not here what we’re saying.
Speaker 2: (21:09)
Yeah. No and I think here’s what’s interesting too cause I want you to think back to like maybe moments as a leader. And, you know, I think a lot of times we get put into leadership positions and we’re learning as well, you know. Um, is there any times that in your careers, like a leader and your growth that you’ve kind of had to almost like you messed up, like your perspective was completely skewed and you had to kind of like, Oh shit is like you, you’re right guys. I was an idiot. And like, I dunno, like do you think of any crossroads or, or, or loses in your leadership, you know, career that’s kind of stood out to you?
Speaker 3: (21:46)
Um, I could, I think of some. How about, can I think of many? Uh, and there’s going to be many mistakes that we make solely because again, that’s all we know. We’ll come to the table and say, well, I know what’s best, so we need to go with this. Um, and a perfect example is when we actually started our lead generation team almost two years ago, my CEO brought this idea and he said, hey, direct sales is awesome. How do we get a direct sales team to branch off and go do lead generation? And I, I laughed. I was like, yeah, right can go out and they can knock their own. They can close their own. What do we need setters for? I’m not doing that. So I literally go down to the office that I was going to see that day and I said, hey guys, I, I pitch on direct and I pitch how great everyone’s doing, what closing their own deals. And I said, hey guys, who wants to go out there and open leads for everybody?
Speaker 3: (22:31)
I said, that’s what I thought. And I moved on. I didn’t even pitch the idea. I’ll tell you this. A couple of weeks later, I sit back in front of my CEO, asked me, Christian, I really need you to go get this done. This is a, this is a great business model for our business. I know you can go through with it. He said, I need you to do this for me. I go back, I re pitch it. Our lead generation currently is the number one form of our leads into the company that are, our closers can go close these deals. So literally drove, lead acquisition costs down, has made our business much more sustainable and allowed us to introduce others into the solar sector without, uh, dealing with the long install tams or whatnot. So literally changed the landscape of our business. And that’s something that I did not see his perspective at first and I’m messed up.
Speaker 2: (23:13)
Yeah, that’s a, that’s a really good example. Um, and this is kind of segues us into like one of these topics on a talk on, cause you know, roofers and I mean even alarm guys and solar specific especially there’s this whole set or closer debate like do I go hire some centers? How do I hire some centers? Do I get closers on the, is it, is it lady? Like what are the pain points? What are the structures? I mean neck that kind of leads us into this. So I, you know, I am going to be candid. I did the set of program for a year and a half and I got to a point where I was like, f this and I shut off. I shut it down. I just said, either you’re a center and you figure out how to close or you’re a closer and you figure out how to get off the couch and uh, let’s, uh, let’s make a company where guys go eat what they kill.
Speaker 2: (24:00)
You know what I mean? I’m sick of like, I want to talk to this. This is, this is the part where I’m like, how do you, this is the question. I’m running a solar company and I’ve got a bunch of closers and all of a sudden my sets dip a little bit. What am I closers do? They sit on the freaking couch. It’s like, how do you motivate the closer when he doesn’t have any damn appointment to go knock once he’s been spoon fed for the last two weeks? You know what I mean? Like that’s my question. I want to solve this problem. And it sounds like you’ve probably dealt with it. So I want to know what do you do?
Speaker 3: (24:36)
What will, the question is, is your lead generation program, is that sustainable in the first place? Right. And I think that’s something that we, that we battled in our initial, our initial months, our initial year with introducing lead generation is because as you know, you recruit an entire team over. They come on, they perform, they see the next best thing, they leave, right? So how do we create a proprietary model? Whereas our lead generators feel comfortable, they understand the growth and ultimately creates a sustainable lead flow for our closers. Now here and on top of that, it’s about setting the proper expectations. You know, Sam, if I recruit you today and I say, Sam, I’m going to give you 20 appointments every single month no matter what. Even if there’s a storm outside, that’s just not realistic to be able to provide a baseline of leads for you. Let’s say if we’re going to promise you 15 leads or 15 leads a month, knowing that we have the ability to provide 30 to 40 leads per month for that person, right?
Speaker 3: (25:27)
So our expectation by saying, hey, in the down ones, we’re looking for you to not only go self gen, I’ll go increase your referrals. So what we did was we created a program to incentivize our closers to capitalize on referrals, whereas we don’t mind paying the customer out of the company’s pocket for a larger referral, which incentivizes our guys to say, Hey, not only are we going to get a higher commission when we go generate our own deals, but we, our company companies also supported us in the referrals. So I think from your perspective, Sam, where you’re just creating the lead Gen, uh, that’s a fantastic first step. But we have to make sure all of the other channels are in line with the proper expectations on what we’re expecting from our lead generation program. You know, they’re, they’re not, they’re not, they’re not our bread and butter. They’re our bread. We still have butter. So, Ooh. So let me, let me ask you,
Speaker 2: (26:19)
you recruit a center or a lead and guide, what’s the expectation you set for him?
Speaker 3: (26:25)
Yeah, again, a really good question. So let’s, let’s back this up. What am I looking for for a lead center and what am I looking for, for a direct guy? Because there’s, there’s two different, and I would classify direct as a guy who can knock on his own and closes zone. So just so just for a clear leads that are all he’s doing, all he or she is doing is setting the lead and passing it off, right. So we’re looking, we’re looking for a couple of things. Um, if you’re entry level, if you don’t have sales experience whatsoever, um, let’s bring you in. Let’s teach you up on this. We meet every single day. We have a very unique training program or we’re not looking for our sales reps to go out to the individual officers and train would centralize it. Every single one of our lead generators comes into corporate for a full day and are we provide them with a very symmetrical training throughout the entire company right
Speaker 4: (27:11)
now. Even if you recruited a guy in Massachusetts, you’re going to bring him into New Jersey. Even if he’s just to be better. It’s worth your time and money. He has no experience, no chance of no proof that it will actually work out. You’re still going to say come to New Jersey,
Speaker 3: (27:25)
100% against your butt down here. We want to make sure, number one, Sam, that you’re bought into us. You have to see who we are, right? So not only setting the proper expectations, but we have to sell our brand. We’d have to sell our people and we have to sell our company, right? Because as you know endorsed, it’s going to be difficult out there. There’s gonna be days that you don’t get deals. So what we found was it was difficult to bring guys into the from any industry and get them into solar. So for our lead Gen, we really set the expectation around that, hey, you’re going to be able to go out, you’re going to be able to have a quick conversation. And what we call it, a demo can sit that day. So it’s very similar to our law, an alarm, but you’re not stepping one foot inside of the house.
Speaker 3: (28:04)
You’re knocking on the door, you’re getting them interested. If that appointment sits, you’re being compensated from our company, which is pretty awesome. So the expectation is this isn’t a four month summer where you’re going to go make a hundred grand, we’re going to give you a great income. Whereas you can go out and make anywhere, let’s say between 30 and 75 grand over the year, just going and knocking on doors. Right? The expectation for us is to be able to make, let’s say two warm transfers a day. All you have to do is knock on the door and get someone to agree to take the appointment. Again, not selling anything, just take the appointment to talk to someone else to be educated on solar. So that’s the expectation. They’re very, very minimal. I’m not looking for the guy to come out and, you know, set 50 leads in a day.
Speaker 3: (28:46)
It’s just not realistic. We’re looking for a sustainable way where as we can recruit locally, not go out to California or Arizona or wherever it may be. Look, we’re a New Jersey, right? I want to give our home people some jobs. Um, and not, not complicated. Um, as much as the direct sales process where not only do they have to learn how to knock, they have to learn how to get inside the home. You have to learn how to close and then you off to learn how to retain. That’s a lot for one person to learn. So let’s do this. Let’s simplify this, let’s give you a sustainable cashflow and let’s teach you the entry part of our business to be able to get you to go be your own closer. So is that, is that the, the path, like when you sit down and think, God, is the path like
Speaker 4: (29:26)
we’re going to graduate you at one point or another into it your own closing ability
Speaker 3: (29:32)
or is it Kinda like we’re recruiting you to be in a setter for forever? I mean is as they’re like a clear path that you give him or is it like, or is it like in a month or in six months you’re going to then transition or like, yeah, it kind of, what’s that path to become a closer look like? Yeah, so that’s a good question because you could say, well Christian, you have your lead centers. Do you ever direct guys? Obviously someone’s making more money. How do you protect that? Um, but yeah, and they look, we’re going to back into what their, what their goals are. Right? Are you looking to go go be a, let’s say a couple hundred thousand dollar type guy? Are you just looking for a sustainable income? Judy, your current lifestyle, you know, you may have someone that just provides my family to their, I’m sorry, provides money to their family on a consistent basis where they don’t have the ability to go out and learn for four months to go knock doors or go learn for two months without a sale.
Speaker 3: (30:20)
It’s just not going to happen. While there is a natural progression to bring someone into our lead generation program and then get them off to direct and then eventually, let’s say into our soul closer program. Um, but again, sustainability, whereas they have a consistent income with what they’re doing. So they’re not, we’re not paying them to less that they don’t want to stay there and we’re not paying them too much that they do want to stay there. We’re giving them a very fair income, whereas they can stay in lead generation, right. For the consistent cashflow, not dealing with the long end salt unsal times all the paperwork to, and you know this Sam, it’s, it’s, it can be a mess when you’re in direct sales, right? You are, you are your own manager. Um, so again, we have some, we have some of our reps who have been in let’s our outreach, we call it outreach for three years now and they love it.
Speaker 3: (31:06)
But what we also do is we give them a path to management, whereas our district managers from EP, from 15 of our outreach offices, they’re only required the knock on certain days, right? So there’s a progression to get into management. There’s a progression to get into director manager over an outreach team. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So they don’t really like keep going. Sorry, I just wanted to clarify that. Yeah, no, no worries at all. So against, let’s say you come in as a rep, uh, what’s the progression? What you can come in, you have a couple of options you can to make a very healthy career, making a very fair income. Let’s say 50 to 60 grand a year, knocking doors for a living. Right? You love knocking doors. You don’t want to get inside of the home. Uh, you don’t want to carry it. You’re, you’re, you’re a deal from yesterday on to next week.
Speaker 3: (31:46)
You’re done with that customer, right? You have the guy that wants to grow into management. So we’ve built up every single one of our lead generation offices has their own district manager and assistant district manager, whereas there’s two smaller and they run meetings every day. They run meetings every single day. Okay. Which is, which is to what time it may mean, I’m curious, what time did they meet? Yeah, definitely. They made it 10 o’clock every single day. So this morning I got a, right now it’s 10 32. Um, I watched the team walk into one of the back offices this morning at nine but not out on Saturdays. They start at nine and I’ll call center closes at four. So again, so they’re inshore. Yeah, exactly. Yup. And did, what time did they go every day? So their media here, we did 10 other than Saturday, then they made it into mine on Saturday.
Speaker 3: (32:30)
And then what time do you expect them to knock two. And how do you hold them accountable to that? Yeah, good question. So the call center closes at eight, so we’re not taking out, it’s seasonal, right? In the summer we’ll go until nine, but right now it’s currently eight. So we’re only asking them, uh, to work, let’s say from 12 to eight. Very simple. Well, we’ve also done is we’ve created a, again, a very sustainable pay model for the outreach reps, whereas we pay them a base salary. Sam, you know, it’s obviously production based. So if you don’t hit your production, it actually comes out to be the exact same thing as a commission. Payscale. Um, because if you don’t hit the middle of expectations, well we, we can’t keep you as an employee. Very simple. Right? So kind of the same obstacle that you came with, hey, either you learn or are you got to get out? I, I can’t, can’t keep you around, you know, potentially a habituating certain areas if it’s not going to be beneficial to you and us at the same time. So same thing.
Speaker 4: (33:21)
Yeah, of course it’s done sets or based on shown appointment, showing appointments, showing appointments. Okay. Yup. So we, go ahead. No. So then do you expect them to utility but with that or do you find that that’s not super necessary? Okay.
Speaker 3: (33:37)
Nothing at all. Other than basic qualifications, do you have a six 50 credit score? When we call into the call center, all call center is scrubbing every single lead that comes in. Um, so as soon as they call in, all the computers were popped up. We’re looking at this site and then at that point we’re placing it on a salesman’s calendar to go run that appointment.
Speaker 4: (33:56)
We also the center, so he knocks and he’s like, I’m going to get you on with my call center real quick, confirm the appointment. And they kind of confirm and schedule it with the closer right there. Absolutely. Cool. Um, okay, so that helps me understand the whole center outreach. Now it’s like, help me understand this whole closer, you said there’s this outreach program, then you have this, uh, direct direct program and then you had this soul closer program, which are just the closer, so direct. This is where I feel like there’s like this mental barrier.
Speaker 2: (34:32)
It’s like if I have, uh, if I have guys that are like getting a couple of leads a week, cause like you said, you’re like, I might be able to provide you 15 leads a month or so. And that’s, you know, that’s not a, that’s not three a day. You know what I mean? So this guy that’s in direct, he’s getting a couple week it sounds like. Right.
Speaker 3: (34:56)
A guy that is in direct, they’re getting nothing
Speaker 2: (34:58)
going out there. Oh, okay. So all of these centers aren’t sending anything for direct?
Speaker 3: (35:04)
Uh, no. We have one called a solar pro, which is more on the traditional side. Let’s say an experienced guy who’s just a high volume guy that we know if we can provide a couple appointments with a, you can increase your sales, but ultimately direct is just door knockers who close their own deals.
Speaker 2: (35:19)
Okay, so let’s talk about those guys. How often do they meet?
Speaker 3: (35:22)
They meet twice a week. So every Tuesday and Friday, uh, typically a two hour meeting. And then for rookies we bring them in one hour early to instruct them on some of the things I need to know.
Speaker 2: (35:31)
And so they’re just your traditional solar gig. Every set, close everything. Now let me ask you this. At what point did they say, how come I’m not getting sets? What do you have? What do you, what do you say to that? Like what? Like I’m sure that those conversations come up. Why I should be a solar closer. I should only, I should be getting all the appointments. I’m a bad day. Like why don’t I get the sets? Like, I’m sure you’ve had that guy, Sam are you might reference, come on. No, I actually do it. It’s funny, anybody that’s worked for me, and you guys can validate this, I didn’t take sets. Like I was like screw the sets as boring. Like I was like, why am I driving around the fricking state trying to get appointments when I can go knock a door next door and it takes me two seconds to get to a point.
Speaker 3: (36:17)
I’m the same way. I like to increase the opportunities. I like to put my feet in my own hands. I’ve never taken a lead either. So it’s pretty different that we created this program. But of course that’s the organic question. Everyone says, ah, why can’t I get leads? So here’s this, uh, we create the pace. So it’s very even, uh, to incentivize the right behaviors, right? So our direct guys, they’re gonna make, they’re gonna make more per kilowatt. I’m our traditional guys. What? We’re going to charge them a lead fee. And on top of that, you’re going to make less per kilowatt. It’s just, it’s just as simple as that. You’re going to get leads. We have to cover the costs of our lead generators. Um, and it’s a different expectation in regards to leadership. We pay our direct managers a little bit different than we do our traditional team because again, the traditional team, they’re going out there, they’re creating their own deals.
Speaker 3: (37:01)
Um, it’s a little bit longer of a process because they don’t have as much back in support where it’s our direct, we have an entire room in the back who creates their own contracts and kicks it back to the Reps. So all they have to do is knock the door, get the bill right, sign a letter of intent, right? Our internal team will create the contract and kick it back to them. So the PR, the appropriate answer is we incentivize the pay the right way to reduce those questions. Now, let’s, let’s say a guy says, Hey, well I want to go into traditional was just as which just are closer. Well, fantastic. We’ll put you with the leaders of those divisions. You’ll interview with those teams if you have the sales qualifications and the certifications to be able to understand how to navigate a deal.
Speaker 3: (37:41)
Because again, you’re creating it on your own. You’re designing your own system, you’re using multiple different finance partners, let’s say mosaic sunlight dividend. You have to understand the knowledge of the solar landscape. Uh, so if you don’t have the aptitude, if you don’t have the aptitude to get in that division, and that’s not calling someone stupid, not at all. But if you don’t, if you’re not tech savvy, if you don’t understand the numbers, well that’s not the best division for you. If you’re not organized, if you’re not the most structured, stay in direct. We’re going to give you everything that you need there. Really. So, so Sam, to, to, to make this a broader scope, but we’re looking at what division people should go into. We’re looking at three main things, attitude, aptitude, and work ethic, right? They and they all three are totally different. So again, we set the proper expectations with our sales teams to make sure they understand why or why they’re not. Why or why, why aren’t they and those a certain divisions and draw the line. Very firm, the sand. But if I were to go ahead,
Speaker 4: (38:38)
yeah, no, keep going. I have two good questions.
Speaker 3: (38:41)
If I were to say that we didn’t have those issues as we continue to grow, I’d be lying to you. We absolutely have those things where a guy says, well I want to be that guy. Well we tell them, hey, you’re trading in your, your direct culture, the knocking, the grittiness, the aggressive for traditional, slower paced type sale, whereas that may be more sustainable for your lifestyle. So again, each channel has their perks. Um, I’m a direct guy. I love knocking. I love getting out there. I love the hype. Uh, my boy. Yeah man, my voice is a little bit raspy cause I had a meeting yesterday and I’m a, I’m a go or man, I’m very similar to yourself, full of energy and uh, yeah dude, that, that’s, that’s just me. So I’m with you on that.
Speaker 4: (39:21)
So let me ask you this, how much interaction do this three parties have? Does that make sense? Like do they have combined meetings? Do they interact with each other or is it Kinda like I don’t even know who’s on the outreach team. I’m on direct. I couldn’t even tell you. I don’t even know who the solar closer cause I’m in direct. Like is it very separated or is it very like, yeah, we all meet together and chat or I guess what’s the interaction there?
Speaker 3: (39:49)
Yeah, Sam, that’s the question. They were all combined and we found that the manager from weren’t providing relevant content to each division as of when we separated the channels. Right. Whereas outreach directly traditional all meet on different days. Now what happens is once a month we all get together. Like yesterday we had a combined meeting with our outreach direct and traditional divisions and it’s not teaching on trainings. We’re not instructing on how to get a deal to the roof. We’re solely instructing on culture or making sure the hype in the office is the right the right thing. We’re making sure the, the, the, the pulse is healthy. So again, no training whatsoever. When we get all the teams together, it’s really for culture, hype, um, you know, really lighting the vision of the entire company, not specifically on each division.
Speaker 4: (40:37)
I liked that. I liked that. Um, because I think, I think what happens, like you just said is it’s like there’s such different programs and if you try to meet together, it’s people aren’t getting the value that they need to. Um, and then so he has its own manager, assistant manager type structures. Okay. What about competitions? Because there’s such different metrics, how do you do like companywide competitions and things like that because you, no one’s getting just a fricking bit like appointment. One’s getting their own closest. So there are grittier and another one’s getting spoonfed. Like is there, is there some difficulty or some best practices when you’re trying to create a competition and track numbers and stuff like that?
Speaker 3: (41:20)
Absolutely. Just like anything. It was, it was, it was a trial and error, whereas we had Friday to do a competition that was very, uh, very symmetrical between all divisions. We found that, hey, it’s just not possible. So the prizes, the trips, everything’s same. But we backed into what metrics are you cool then to a sale? Right. So if our, if were to ask you the question, Sam, how many alarms would you say could account for one solar sail? Three. Four, yeah, I would say three to one. So we’re very symmetrical in that. Whereas we say the almost very similar to our outreach and sales team, right? We say we have a Dominican Republic trip coming up. So we say in Q four you have to have 80 demos. That means 86 to qualify. But sales, you only need 30 sales. So you can see the ratios, whereas the prizes are identical.
Speaker 3: (42:05)
But the metrics to get through those are vastly different. Now to answer your second question, how do our direct guys and our traditional guys, um, how are guys and Gals, how do they compete in competitions? Again, very different metrics. Whereas you can get a point for just generating an account. Whereas traditional, you only get a point for closing the account. But on direct mail. Yeah, the opportunity to close and yet health Janet. But remember traditional guys, remember we ask them for referrals and a self gen so they have the same opportunity to get the amount of points, but direct has the strength and going to self during their own. So organically a direct guy will typically win the competitions. Uh, unless a traditional guy says, hey, I’m going to go self Jimsom and they can, they can go compete for the top spots.
Speaker 4: (42:49)
I love that. I love the, so let’s Kinda dive into, I mean I don’t want to dive into this a ton, but because obviously this is what you’re training on, it ordered Orrcon but it’s like year in and year out, you know, you’re kind of getting monotonous. It’s the same job. It’s a year round program. Have you found any best practices as far as systems and structures to keep your guys motivated? You know, through trial and error that you’re like, okay, this is a year round thing. This is a job. It’s not a sprint, but like we all get to get an hustle because I felt like one of my biggest struggles, you know, I go and consult a lot of these companies, it’s like I, I’ll, I’ll tell you one, this is great. I trained on this thing, the power hour and uh, this company, you know, hey in the morning, you know, I was like, Eh, in the morning you got to have your power hour, et cetera.
Speaker 4: (43:37)
Well they misinterpreted it. They call me and they’re like, dude, this was like three weeks after I met with him. We did it, we implemented your power hour and our sales have tripled. And I was like, what? And I was like, that’s like not a really interesting correlation, you know what I mean? I was like, how does that even correlate? Okay. And they’re like, yeah, we got all of her guys to go knock at least one hour a day. And I was like, whoa. Like you tripled cause you got your guys to go out for an hour. What are you guys are actually committed to going out for the whole day? You know what I mean? I was like, holy cow. And I was like, no, this is called the power nine hour like Warburg, like anyways. So I feel like in solar it’s really hard sometimes because everybody is so independent. Have you found a way to hold their accountability to like just working the hours? Yeah,
Speaker 3: (44:30)
well hard Sam, because
Speaker 2: (44:32)
if you say if you’re expecting every single employee, you have to have that mindset of hey, I can do this all the time. Um, it’s just not common. Especially if you come from that, from the door to door industry. You’re, you’re, you’re used to working, I’m sorry you’re used to working spurts. Um, whereas here you’re working year round. So really our footprint, having a career, right. How do you, how do you work here for 10 years? I’m really not interested in a view and you, if you want to come out and try it out, I want you to look here and I want you to develop a lifestyle that you can sustain your family year after year after year. I don’t want you and a half to be submitting resumes and next year are going to interview with a different company in San Juan who we’re a w two company.
Speaker 2: (45:11)
So we give that, we give the value to our employees of, uh, you know, uh, medical, dental, vision four, one k life insurance. Um, so for the companies that are listening out there, it’s the offering that you have your employees, not just the pay scale or the product that you’re working on. How do you invest in their lives for the long term? And that’s something that will speak on every single, you know, every, not every meeting, but every big meeting that we’ll have is that there’s been a guy here for 10 years, has been a guy here for 15 years, then got here for 20 years. Uh, and really it’s, it’s our consistency and delivering for our employees on a consistent basis. That’s why I love competitions. I love incentives. Um, but again, I’ll bring it up again. The carrots and sticks don’t always work.
Speaker 2: (45:48)
What can they rely on every single day that they come to work? And that’s something that we want to do. We have to be sustainable for them. We have to be an essence predictable for them. They shouldn’t come to work saying, well, what’s next? No, I love that because I think a lot of times we’re like, it’s almost like we’re enrolling them, that they do this job to win a competition. They’re not doing this job to take pride in the job and a career that they chose. Yeah. You know what I mean? It’s like almost like a higher cause it’s like, look, I’m doing this. Like if I didn’t show up to my work today, like whether I’m a janitor or a plumber or whatever, and I came home and my wife was like, hey, how did work go today? And I looked her in the eye and I go, oh, I just haven’t been going. It’s like, you know what I mean? Like fathom that. And it’s so funny, like the way that you just put that, it’s like, wait a minute, it’d be like telling my wife, it’s like I have a job. I’m the meat per, I’m the, I’m the breadwinner here. I provide it and I’m going to look you in the eye and be like, yeah, I just don’t go.
Speaker 3: (46:52)
It’s funny. I say a very similar example. I say, you don’t, do you really think the garbage man goes home, goes home to his family and says, oh, it smells like trash every day. No, they’re used to it. That’s what they signed up for. This is, this is the sector that they’re in. They’re not looking for, oh, I hope next week I’ll go pick up some flowers. No, you’re going to pick up garbage every single day. That’s what you do. So to be transparent with you, I don’t even believe in the word burnout. We pay, we pay you to do this job. You’re not doing it for free. Right. So we want to there
Speaker 2: (47:23)
nugget nugget. You know what I mean? Like it’s like you get compensated. It’s a, it’s a job. It’s something that you need to take pride in and take serious because I just think like, I dunno, I think maybe we do incentivize that sticks in, you know, carrots too much. Like I think it, you’re right. I mean, and, and I get it. It’s fun. It makes it a game. But I think a lot of times people don’t ever really accept or embrace the job. Like this is a job. If you had a normal job, you would work eight hours a day, you better be on the fricking doors for that amount. You know what I mean? Or doing your job that much time. Um, and, and, and you’re right, I think burnout is such a, such an overused term, which is just what, it’s a facade. It’s just, it’s fake. It’s like what is burnout?
Speaker 3: (48:12)
It’s just an excuse. And you know, what I found is every, excuse it, it’s an excuse. That’s why it’s called an excuse. It makes sense to you. You know what I mean? You can, if you can separate the emotion from, okay man, this is door to door or how about this is I’m going to be here for a very long time and I’m going to be able to provide consistently for my family. And that’s something I would encourage all the companies out there who have door to door stop pitching on the short term success pitch on the long game. Let these gals understand that they have value in your company and they can stay with you for as long as they want to be there. Right. Provide them that consistency and that sustainability so they can feel safe in their job. That’s a big, that’s an important thing that we, I think we miss on Sam. You know, a person should feel safe in their career. I shouldn’t feel like if I have to go to this market next year and it’s going to be tough. No, put some roots down. Right. Have, have some consistency in your life. Have the discipline to go to your job every single day. Go deliver and you’ll be happier. You’ll be at that company for as long as you want to be there.
Speaker 2: (49:11)
I love the, um, of the, um, okay, so we got to kind of wrap out, wrap up. Do you have any, I mean dude, honestly like I’ve just appreciated your time. Like this has just been, I’m like, this is this a congress. It’s like the why I love these podcasts is it’s like we’re just GM in like if we were just like going to lunch and it’s like tell me all your tummy or your love and nuggets and just about you. This is cool. So one last question I always ask people and honestly make out, make sure that you guys wrote to Christians workshop. He’s going to be probably one of the crowd favorites and those that don’t know him, obviously it’s like this is such an interesting event because people understood the talent, the knowhow, the expertise that’s coming to door to door con.
Speaker 2: (49:58)
I think people would pay five grand for a freaking ticket, like people that are paying 150100200 bucks for a ticket right now. I’m literally saying like you literally, you ever profession where you can go rub shoulders with guys like Christian and you’re going to go pick their brain. I mean Christian, you get to go to the VIP dinner. I know probably Chris and those guys talked about it last year. So you get a free ticket to the VIP dinner. Um, and you know, I think like being able to hang out with guys like this, you know, we’ve all heard it. You surround yourself with the best, you become the best. And it’s like, I think people, um, they don’t go to your workshop there in the roofing or solar people that are trying to run these, you know, and motivate and be better leaders there. They’re crazy. So, uh, but my last, my last question that I have for you, it would be, um, if you could give the door to door industry one piece of advice, what would it be?
Speaker 3: (50:55)
Goodness man. If you want to build a ship, don’t drum up people to collect wood and don’t assign them tasks and work, but rather teach them to long for the endless immensity of the sea.
Speaker 2: (51:09)
Hmm. Say that one more time. One more time.
Speaker 3: (51:13)
If you want to build a ship, don’t drum up people to collect wood and don’t assign them tasks and work, but rather teach them to long for the endless immensity of the sea. Wow. Meaningful. Yeah, man.
Speaker 2: (51:26)
And so I guess why, why, why, why that quote? Expound on that. I mean, that was, I mean, you could just Mike drop and walk away. I mean, I don’t want to like leave her, but he’s just like,
Speaker 3: (51:37)
yeah, that’s okay. No problem. Right? It’s, it’s, it’s not about the little things that we can accomplish, right? We look for those in our daily, once they get through our day, but play the long game. Again, as I said it, we look at this in such short sprints. If you look at this in the long game, you ride the middle wave and you look at this as a career versus just a job. This becomes a lot more, a lot more satisfactory to your own, your own being. It feels good on you. So right at the end it says, rather teach them to long for the endless immensity of the sea. That means it’s not going to be easy, right? It’s not going to be, it’s going to be fricking hard and it’s going to be long. I’m not looking for you to go knock one door today and come back and so I can reward you.
Speaker 3: (52:14)
I’m looking for you to develop a new human being that I can have, I can have in my company for the long haul. Right. And I believe that’s all, that’s how all of our leaders treat our people here. Such as my co, a senior vice president, Chris Gallagher, and all of our guys in here. We’re teaching these guys life life, life skills that whether they’re here at our company forever, they’re going to go make another company a damn good company because they’ve taught him great qualities for sustainability, right, for the long haul. Played the long game, man, played the long game.
Speaker 2: (52:42)
Love it. Will do. Thanks so much for your time. And it’s been fun jamming this morning and uh, yeah, we’ll see it. We’ll see in January. Brother Brad. Thanks Dan. Have a good day.